Drewry Lane - Pics and update

Drewry Lane - Pics and update

Postby stu » Wed Oct 21, 2009 11:59 pm

Hi,
We've got a lot of new build being done at work and a few months ago I noticed a skip with some decently sized MDF and timber offcuts in it . Spoke to the builders who said take what you want - so I did - though had no immediate idea of how I was going to use it.
However we have a local "village hall" show and St Jude has been exhibited there a few times over the past years. I was asked back again this year but said no reasoning the punters probably wouldn't be too impressed. It did though give me an excuse to start thinking about something new. I had, and still do, think about going into EM. In fact I'd actually done some conversions to run on another layout, a sort of toe in the water. But doodling a trackplan on one of the boards, and I tend to favour small layouts, quickly exposed the one major flaw. Unless it was going to be very basic then using EM points kits I was going to quickly run out of space.
I'd dug out some used Peco long radius points to play with potential EM plans and then realised I had a whole boxful of assorted recovered points. Sorting them out I discovered the best selection available was a load of Code 100 stuff including offcuts of plain track. Slowly the idea of a "recycled" layout started to appear out of the creative fog.
Having thought the thing through again I intially thought of something along these lines http://www.carendt.com/scrapbook/page84/index.html scroll down to North Leigh but eventually decided on a freight only plan.
The final trackplan is complete tosh but inspired by somewhere that did exist. When the Abbotsbury branch closed in '52 the line to the first station on the branch, Upwey, was kept open as freight only for more than a decade.
DrewryLane1.jpg

I've going to use the project to try out new things to me. For the first time I’ve used switches to change both the points and the polarity of the electrofrogs. When I tested the layout i was impressed as to how it worked. It's going to be DCC but thats only because most of my stock is already that. Being this small it going to be mainly small loco's such as a 350hp shunter or a pannier.
DrewryLane 3.jpg

In an attempt to make the Code 100 track look less clunky it has been infilled with art card plus the backscene, also recycled from something, added. That gives an idea where this is all going. The tracked has been sprayed a dark brown so the ballasting is next. One question I do have is what are the preffered colours for painting the rail sides. I’ve tended to use a dark earth but know others use different shades. On the question of ballasting it’s something I’m not that confident about as it rarely turns out as I expect so I shall be trawling around to see what others do.
Stu
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby Puds » Thu Oct 22, 2009 9:16 am

stu wrote:One question I do have is what are the preffered colours for painting the rail sides. I’ve tended to use a dark earth but know others use different shades.
Stu, it's all down to personal choice and how you percieve rust, but it can vary in shades so much depending on the surrounding conditions I suppose. On Pudley Lane I used a combination of Humbrols matts 113 and 160, and after some weathering of the trackwork as a whole with the residues from my brush cleaning pots, I ended up with this............

2008_1009UckfieldPrepWork080020.JPG


You could always use something like Humbrol 62 (leather I think) to give a lighter appearence of fresher rust, weathered with gunmetal, or you could even try using some Gun Casey Blue Solution, as Martyn Welch does.

On the question of ballasting it’s something I’m not that confident about as it rarely turns out as I expect so I shall be trawling around to see what others do.
Well, there's always the method both Butoxeter and I use, of which is brushing PVA around the trackwork, and then sprinkling on the ballast. It's a time consuming job, yet very rewarding. Whether it would work with Peco track is another thing though, as the sleepers are fairly deep, and so you'd require a good layer of glue or ballast I suppose!

Look forward to watching this little project progress by the way.
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby stu » Fri Oct 23, 2009 10:11 pm

Hi,
Thanks for that. I'm going to give the glue then ballast a try. Thinking about it it actually seems more logical and it's not as if I've a huge amount of track to. Went and scrounged a handful of plastic pipettes from chem dept today.
I'll try that colour combo for the rails as well and see how it looks. Peco will never look like scale track but the likes of Mr Nevard do a very convincing job so I'll have look at some of his photo's as well.
Cheers
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby stu » Fri Nov 13, 2009 10:54 pm

Progess has been slow of late whilst I got an eye problem seen to which was a tad worrying but tht's largely sorted now.
As to the next stage I'm not a lover of ballasting as rather like my patio laying I never seem to get it quite right. Anyhow for better or worse it's down. This time I tied putting the glue down and then adding the ballast. I have to say I did find it easier than the more conventional method though with the caveat of glue, add ballast then walk away and let gravity do the rest. I tried titivating a small section and made a mess.
Image
For the sidings I infilled the sleepers using modelling clay a method suggested by Chris Nevard. Not perfect by any means but a lot less messier than using plaster.
I then started spraying the track with mixed results and expect it'll now take a couple of goes to get it acceptable. One thing recent events have highlighted is getting the illumination I'm using right for work like this so it looks like the garage is in for a lighting revamp pretty promptly.
While that's in hand I started on the scenery side. Nothing exotic here simply some rolling hills to flank the bridge hiding the entrance to the fiddle yard. It’s only the basics so far but it will at least give an idea of where this is going.

Image

Any comments, observations or advice welcome. In particular any further thoughts on track colour. I’ve spent a bit of time looking a pics of layouts and how they colour their track and ended up confused – my normal state.........!
Cheers
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby Neil » Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:10 pm

stu wrote:.... Any comments, observations or advice welcome. In particular any further thoughts on track colour. I’ve spent a bit of time looking a pics of layouts and how they colour their track and ended up confused – my normal state.......


You're maybe getting confused with track colouring because of looking at lots of different layouts rather than one prototype. When I'm thinking about colour, I like to have one master photo which shows all the different surfaces I want to portray in the season and climatic conditions of my choice. Having one photo and copying the colours off that as best I can gives a good start when trying to capture something of real life. Trying to abstract bits that you like from several different layouts and then blend them into one could be a bit hit and miss.
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby Puds » Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:13 pm

stu wrote:Any comments, observations or advice welcome. In particular any further thoughts on track colour. I’ve spent a bit of time looking a pics of layouts and how they colour their track and ended up confused – my normal state.........!


Don't just observe other peoples work Stu, observe the prototype you're trying to replicate, then you know you can't go wrong ;)
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby stu » Sat Nov 14, 2009 10:39 pm

observe the prototype you're trying to replicate


[quote Having one photo and copying the colours off that as best I can gives a good start when trying to capture something of real life][/quote]
Various books now have bits of paper sticking out of them marking photo's that could be usefull. A bagful of extra paints acquired from Hobbycraft this PM - new local store so had a money off voucher.
I wouldn't think of weathering stock without reference to a photo or two so this probably says a lot about my usual inconsistent approach to things.
One final query - Apart from painting the rails I would normally use an airbrush for doing a job like this. Is this simply a matter of using what you're most comfortable with or am I missing something.
Many thanks Gents, photo's when I've got something to show.
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby MartinWales » Sun Nov 15, 2009 8:47 am

Eagerly awaited Stu-I'm following this thread with renewed interest!
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby stu » Sun Nov 15, 2009 11:13 pm

On grandparent duties this weekend so nothing done. However the weather today has been quite good so we were out and about this morning. Taking onboard the advice above about good pictures to work from I took this.
Image
Not sure the best way to do it when the time comes so will probably be throwing questions in Cookie's direction as I think he did something a bit similar on one of his layouts.
Again thanks for the support Gents.
I'm hoping for a quiet night.............................
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby Puds » Sun Nov 15, 2009 11:35 pm

Stu, you might find some of the limestone dusts that Realistic Modelling Services sell of some use.......... http://www.realisticmodelling.com/catal ... ccessories

I have successful used dried earth in the past aswell with good results.

Or, there's various textured paints available, such as those by Sandtex (if it still exists) or Plastikote.

As you say though, Cookie seems to be the one in the know on this kinda thing of late, though just remember Stu, he works to a bigger scale than us :lol: ;)
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby stu » Mon Nov 16, 2009 11:38 pm

limestone dusts that Realistic Modelling Services sell

You put me on to their stuff at A show in Tonbridge IIRC so I've actually got a bag in the scenics crate. :)
One technique I need to sort out is glueing it down without getting obvious ridgesthat I seem to get even when using well brushed and partyl thinned PVA.
he works to a bigger scale than us

Makes it all the more mind boggling............
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby stu » Sun Nov 22, 2009 11:48 pm

Hi,
Managed to sidle off for an hour and get the first layer of the embankment done. Used the tried and trusted method of newspaper and thinned down PVA. Not very exciting but strangely therapeutic.
Image
Image
At least one of the ad's is appropriate.
So far so good as the general shape looks believable, no 1 in 3 approach roads here thankfully. Equally I'm reasonably happy with the general effect. No offence to anyone here who's done one but I find layouts where the train appears in the middle sometimes a bit unconvincing. Not saying I've done anything much better but think the curved backscene disguises the effect better.

It's the retaining walls and overbridge next.

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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby Puds » Mon Nov 23, 2009 7:33 am

Stu, is there any way you could add a little extension of say a foot to the left hand end, and curve a backscene around it 90deg? I think it's the one thing that's currently missing on this layout, and would finish it off well.
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby Wenbridge » Mon Nov 23, 2009 9:44 am

Puds wrote:Stu, is there any way you could add a little extension of say a foot to the left hand end, and curve a backscene around it 90deg? I think it's the one thing that's currently missing on this layout, and would finish it off well.


I'm not sure I agree about that. It may improve the whole when viewed from the front only, but Stu and those enjoying his layout would lose all those wonderful views to be had looking "up the track". It's probably me, but all things considered I am less keen on those layouts that enforce too many "viewing constraints" as would appear to be the current fashion in this hobby of ours.

It's great to see someone elso who uses the newspaper and diluted PVA method of groundforming. To save diluting your neat stuff Unibond is a good ready mixed source, although quantities are a bit "industrial". As far as your scenic covers "ridging" on watered down PVA, I would suggest using the PVA neat.

I only really got the hang of this when I discovered the 500ml packs of (moderately unknown brand) available from decent toolshops and wood suppliers, it is a heck of a lot cheaper than the Evo Stick etc brands that you see in DIY shops and the sheds. Screwfix or Machine Mart are alternative supplies if you don't have access to a more speciaist retailer.

Look forward to further developments.

Simon

PS For anyone in or near Bristol, check out "Power Fixings" in Brislington, a fantastic shop.
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby noddy » Mon Nov 23, 2009 12:30 pm

I'll add my name to the PVA and newspaper gang :D I picked up a 5 litre tub in B&Q for about £12. I use this neat as its not as thick as most normally are.

Looks like its coming along rather well Stu

Cheers
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby Neil » Mon Nov 23, 2009 12:37 pm

Re papier mache, a friend of mine was a primary school teacher in London during the late seventies. A call went out to parents of the children in his class for newspapers for art/craft lessons. During one lesson he discovered that one enterprising chap had exclusively used page three stunnas for his piece of art; in particular the bristols.

Just thought you'd like to know that.

Further tip passed on by the same friend is to use old yellow pages as intervening layers to keep track of where you are.
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby Butoxeter » Mon Nov 23, 2009 2:28 pm

Neil wrote:page three stunnas for his piece of art; in particular the bristols

Not quite sure if that was the Bristol recommendation Simon was making above... :P :P
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby stu » Mon Nov 23, 2009 11:56 pm

Hi,
Before I settled on the final trackplan I played around with some different setups including one where the backscene was in a continuous arc, where it was a conventional box and probably am couple I can't remember.
The limiting factor was the board size that would fit comfortably in the back of the car but I think I've got the trackplan where I could have extensions if needed.
But to wander off for a bit I think presentation is important and part of the overall package. You look at the work of people like Chris Nevard and our own Cookie for example and there's a coherent whole. I know we should be concentrating on the modelling but I can think of a couple of quite well known layouts which when you see them for real are left feeling that they haven't quite gone the whole nine yards. Lighting for example can, I think, make or break a layout and I'm still mildly surprised some exhibtors still rely on the venues lighting.
I also tend scrounge table to display my layouts. That makes them a lot lower than the usual height and while I've never had a complaint it's too low I have overheard the odd comment about a layout being too high. Now I doubt there's a definitive value for optimium layout height so it's up to everyone to make their own choice but I wish some exhibitors would think about their layout height and facia opening dimensions as some combinations can be a bit arkward.

Anyhow been sorting out a couple of potential bridge sides and painting the plasticard brickwork prior to sticking on.

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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby stu » Thu Dec 10, 2009 7:21 pm

Hi,
By my standards progress is glacially slow but a bt more progress has been made. The bridge retaining walls, though not obvious in these rather poor photos, are in place as is the parapet. It will still need some work on the underside to put in the support girders. The embankment has had a coat of plaster which is taking an age to go off but will get a coat of paint ans some washes before the greenery goes on.

Image
Image

I also got rather exasperated with how the track was looking as I couldn't seem to get it right. In the end I decided I was trying to be too clever, mixed up some black and brown into what I thought a pot of commercial track colour would be like and spraed that over it all acquiring a few inconvenient spills in the process. I'm actually quite pleased with the result though it looks a bit odd in the photo.
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby Cock Sparra » Fri Dec 11, 2009 7:25 pm

Hi Stu

Can I make a suggestion for pre-colouring the plaster before applying it by adding powder paint available from ELC (Early learning centres) it comes only in primary colours but by mixing them you can get the colours you require, the thing to remember though is that the dry a lighter shade than when wet. The big plus with pre-colouring is that if it gets chipped there is no white to show.

Cheers Phil
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby Clive » Sat Dec 12, 2009 5:04 am

Hi Stu

Cor Blimey mate, 5 points :shock:

It only took a bog break for me to exhaust the operating possibilities of St Jude, this one will take at least 10 minutes :D
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby stu » Sat Dec 12, 2009 9:43 am

Hi,
Whilst I'm still irrationally proud of St Jude and probably should be repeating the exercise but bigger and better I've spent a certain amount of time in the company of a certain Mr (Saxlingham) Tailby who has been doing his best to promote the twin benefits of EM and having a few points around the place and anyone who's been following Dave's recent exploits with Deltic Avenue will understand there's a certain amount of irony in that !
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby stu » Sun Dec 13, 2009 8:19 pm

I've got plenty of projects that I could be doing in a nice warm room indoors but what spare time I have had over the past day or two I've chosen to carry on with the layout in a cold, draughty garage. I've absolutely no deadlines to meet but for some reason it's beginning to suck me in. Go figure!
Image
I've now fitted the fencing along the embankment. It's probably a bit of a cheap trick to hide the baseboard/backscene join this way but I'm happier with this rather than cobbling together a poor attempt to blend forground and background into one seamless view.
Image
The embankment has also now had a coat of white emulsion. This is going to be a partly overgrown chalk embankment when the weathering and greenery are added. The overbridge still has some more detail to be added on the underside to finish it off. I've probably got a few architectural, geological and historical nono's here but IMTS and I'm rather enjoying myself.
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Re: Drewry Lane

Postby MartinWales » Sun Dec 13, 2009 8:44 pm

Coming along nicely Stu and the fence subterfuge is an excellent idea!
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Re: Drewry Lane - two steps forward and a couple back!

Postby stu » Sun Jan 03, 2010 1:24 am

Christmas, family visitations and work have kept me out the garage until the last few days so I've been determined to get on in spite of working in the cold garage.
However it's been two steps forward and almost two steps back. The garage does get very cold and that may have caused some major cracking of the plaster. Anyhow a fair bit of that was knocked off and replaced. I then decided to tidy up the backscene/supports by adding a lip around the top of backscene to hide the 2x1 supports and at the end.
Image
That was relatively easy as I had some poor quality hardboard that was easy to cut and sand to shape and put in place pretty quickly with the aid of the glue gun. Along with the front it will be primed and painted black eventually. Not up to Cookies quality and workmanship but by my standards a tidy job.
Having done this I started to think about what else needs to be done and plonked some stock on the track. Now it's going to be a goods only line but I did put a 121 Railcar on as well for some reason. I'm glad I did as it soon became obvious that something that long would foul the left bridge parapet. I think there must have been a bit of scenery creep somewhere as the clearances were fine when I first started playing around. I could have left it and limited the stock to short vehicles but decided to do it properly.
So the only thing to do was to remove the left parapet and cut back the scenery to give a more generous clearance.
Image
This left the bridge sides woefully short so that had to go as well. A bit of a mess really. The left parapet restoration was actually pretty painless and that's back in place.
Image
Hopefully tomorrow I'll get time to redo the bridge which'll get me back to where I was 2.00pm this afternoon - the joys of modelling

Coming along nicely Stu and the fence subterfuge is an excellent idea!


Thank you :D Getting a bit philosophical for the moment (and hoping it makes sense) I've come to the conclusion there are times when it's better to be realistic in your aims rather than striving to imitate the masters however laudable that is. Using my favourite analogy of patio laying as an example. I've got the tools, read the books, watched the TV programmes and even helped someone who knew what he was doing. But I still can't lay one worth the name. I'm all in favour of encouraging people to have a go at something new but if they do and find they can't then fine. If somethings not doable hen find a workaround or live with it. What does annoy me though is those that won't have a go and then bleat because they can't buy it in a box, something I think is becoming more common. For me and scenery I think it's a case of belatedly developing my own "style" and working on that rather than trying to copy someone elses.
Cheers
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